tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post3034694564421462359..comments2023-08-28T19:10:45.798-04:00Comments on Common Sense Catholicism: Giving the Status Quo a Push (More on the whole Radtrad Debate)Kevin Tierneyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09772355448244959559noreply@blogger.comBlogger20125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-66257613338970872932013-08-02T21:55:14.426-04:002013-08-02T21:55:14.426-04:00Hi Kevin, I agree with what you say here. I also d...Hi Kevin, I agree with what you say here. I also don't use terms in writing like "Neo-Catholic" (although I think I understand it) because I know others find it insulting. <br /><br />Thus I gravitate towards terms like "conservative" or "Conciliar Conservative" because I don't think they are inherently derogatory.<br /><br />What others call us Brennanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09992011209844007299noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-29600139301736377322013-08-02T20:41:33.746-04:002013-08-02T20:41:33.746-04:00Brennan,
I think we can agree there is some utili...Brennan,<br /><br />I think we can agree there is some utility in grouping people according to a preconceived notion. I just think there are some real limitations (some of which you outline) that become so pronounced due to how they play out in reality (and the blogosphere is not reality!), I just tend to think we need to call error error and truth truth.<br /><br />Besides, I think, right now, Kevin Tierneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09772355448244959559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-33210523364595547422013-08-02T20:31:38.693-04:002013-08-02T20:31:38.693-04:00Okay, just for the record, as someone who consider...Okay, just for the record, as someone who considers himself a traditionalist, I think Dave Armstrong was sincere about changing the label "RadTrad" from the get go if someone suggested a better alternative.<br /><br />I also don't really have a problem with labels; the question is, "Are they accurate?" For instance I distinguish between macro and micro evolution because I Brennanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09992011209844007299noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-90664630424887336932013-08-02T20:25:40.398-04:002013-08-02T20:25:40.398-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.Brennanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09992011209844007299noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-52718751422227894562013-08-02T18:12:35.219-04:002013-08-02T18:12:35.219-04:00Again, I don't think the whole "need to c...Again, I don't think the whole "need to compromise" paradigm is apt. <br /><br />Instead, it is as if I point out to you that you are driving your car on the unpaved shoulder of a road. It's not good for your suspension, risks getting a flat tire and generally makes your car dirty. Now if you want to come back to me and say, "How about we compromise on that observation Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08867188454105241834noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-42679623589659194002013-08-02T17:40:29.970-04:002013-08-02T17:40:29.970-04:00I'm not gonna cease using "radtrad" ...I'm not gonna cease using "radtrad" until I have another, and I hope to do so with active participation of the trads who are so concerned about this, so it is a true cooperative effort. You still seem to have but a dim understanding of the nature of compromise itself. One side doesn't just lay down and die and completely capitulate to the other's "demands." It'Dave Armstronghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07771661758539438173noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-73771475417452215832013-08-02T17:10:41.312-04:002013-08-02T17:10:41.312-04:00And if we are all in disclosure mood....
Why did ...And if we are all in disclosure mood....<br /><br />Why did I think your first attempt wasn't serious? Because it ended after 20 hours. Now you say you are back again and looking to figure something out. If that is accompanied with a (at least temporary) ceasing of using the term until you figure out an alterantive, I would say that is one very serious attempt.<br /><br />I'm sure Kevin Tierneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09772355448244959559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-78063881230489862412013-08-02T17:07:17.401-04:002013-08-02T17:07:17.401-04:00Dave,
We actually agree on almost everything. Th...Dave,<br /><br />We actually agree on almost everything. The only thing we differ on is the use of the term "rad trad" or any other attempts to label groups that ultimately marginalize those whom we hope to correct. <br /><br />Please note, the only thing I called "absurd" were your suggestions for new labels instead of "rad trad." I didn't say you weren'tAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08867188454105241834noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-18906502130050672512013-08-02T16:49:57.429-04:002013-08-02T16:49:57.429-04:00That's about all me and Jeff agree on: that yo...That's about all me and Jeff agree on: that you ain't our "daddy"! I'm more than old enough to be yours (though that never matters to you if you are in the mood to lecture me like a snot-nosed kid). ;-)Dave Armstronghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07771661758539438173noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-76287642280895234812013-08-02T16:43:44.747-04:002013-08-02T16:43:44.747-04:00If, e.g., you hounded me off of here because I dis...If, e.g., you hounded me off of here because I disagree too much, on my site I would then say you were an intellectual coward (I don't say that exclusive preaching rather than dialogue amounts to that; it doesn't). <br /><br />You would then say (based on your argument above) that this is an "insult." I would say it is a statement of demonstrable fact, based on the behavior Dave Armstronghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07771661758539438173noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-62177284718255491722013-08-02T16:39:39.763-04:002013-08-02T16:39:39.763-04:00The "Daddy" metaphor is creepy.The "Daddy" metaphor is creepy.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08867188454105241834noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-10378603419881962072013-08-02T16:30:27.637-04:002013-08-02T16:30:27.637-04:00In my mind I didn't! I said you were "Pre...In my mind I didn't! I said you were "Preaching and cheerleading" and giving "pep talks" -- which is what I literally believe most of your posts are. You come right out and say you don't want to dialogue about it. Therefore, by definition and your own report, it is a one-way thing: a monologue, lecture, sermon,or, more colorfully but still accurately, "Dave Armstronghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07771661758539438173noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-34223096125587483322013-08-02T16:18:49.774-04:002013-08-02T16:18:49.774-04:00Just admit you insulted me, I can take it. Me and...Just admit you insulted me, I can take it. Me and Pete Vere insult each other all the time. Still good friends. :) Maybe I even deserved it.<br /><br />I personally didn't see myself a testy, but that's the nature of the internet for you.<br /><br />And Jeff and Dave, please play together nicely. Daddy has to work for a living, and can't continually come home from work to scold Kevin Tierneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09772355448244959559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-63674991143727960232013-08-02T16:04:12.239-04:002013-08-02T16:04:12.239-04:00Sorry to befuddle you with facts. I know they are ...Sorry to befuddle you with facts. I know they are wearisome to you, but we all have our blind spots.Dave Armstronghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07771661758539438173noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-8623393213540972502013-08-02T16:00:42.350-04:002013-08-02T16:00:42.350-04:00Glad to hear all is well with you and your many &q...Glad to hear all is well with you and your many "traditionalist" friends. It's clear that anyone who disagrees with you is just a "rad trad." <br /><br />Very clean. Very simple.<br /><br />Best of luck. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08867188454105241834noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-3149119426123803692013-08-02T15:56:32.209-04:002013-08-02T15:56:32.209-04:00"Clearly you have a challenge when it comes t..."Clearly you have a challenge when it comes to dealing with so-called 'traditionalists.'"<br /><br />Really? I have no problem at all talking to many dozens (if not scores or hundreds) who are on my FB list. We get along fine. Go check out all the likes and vigorous discussion on my thread today about receiving Communion from the priest only. I was just talking to one a few Dave Armstronghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07771661758539438173noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-24423699936604490342013-08-02T15:45:40.940-04:002013-08-02T15:45:40.940-04:00Because you keep saying these things, over and ove...Because you keep saying these things, over and over as if no one has offered any reply or any different solution.<br /><br />I didn't insult at all. I used colorful language.<br /><br />You always get testy whenever you are disagreed with. All of a sudden now I'm the big meanie with cooties again. If it's your wish, I don't have to ever come here again. Just say the word.<br /><brDave Armstronghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07771661758539438173noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-65540875459666629502013-08-02T15:45:33.833-04:002013-08-02T15:45:33.833-04:00I'm curious Dave as to what you want one to sa...I'm curious Dave as to what you want one to say of your proposal if in fact they think it is absurd? How is that an insult to you? Should I patronize you and tell you that it is great that you took the time to make such an effort? Or should I just tell you the truth? <br /><br />Whether I like your proposal or not really doesn't matter. You don't answer to me. You threw them out Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08867188454105241834noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-32907209680810213242013-08-02T14:56:54.916-04:002013-08-02T14:56:54.916-04:00If I'm one who just refuses to discuss things ...If I'm one who just refuses to discuss things with you, ..... why are you here? Do you think coming here and trying to lampoon me is going to somehow alter my opinion?<br /><br /> I for one have already said I'm glad you are willing to compromise, and if you do something concrete, then we know you are serious in addition to being sincere. <br /><br />Like I said, show a good faith Kevin Tierneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09772355448244959559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-964979022938948880.post-85091081613132048622013-08-02T14:22:57.950-04:002013-08-02T14:22:57.950-04:00I've already answered much of this, many diffe...I've already answered much of this, many different ways. You don't want to have a dialogue about it. Your choice. Without a dialogue, it's just preaching. And most preaching is to the choir and so doesn't move the situation forward: doesn't affect those outside the choir. It's just a bunch of folks "in the club" rah-rah-in' each other. <br /><br />Preaching Dave Armstronghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07771661758539438173noreply@blogger.com